Curse

Wasteland Squidget · Aug 21, 2006, 09:00 AM // 09:00

I notice that almost every team we face recently has at least 2 copies of Distortion. It's on every ranger, almost every mesmer, and a fair number of monks.

Any way you slice it, Distortion is an incredibly useful skill. Unless you're facing a caster spike, Distortion is flagstand invulnerability. Health for ranger/mesmer energy is almost always a good trade against pressure teams, and ranger spike doesn't want to hit people with Distortion for obvious reasons. This allows characters with Distortion to be effectively immune to positioning concerns. Mesmers can extend up to blackout monks, rangers can go harrass a flagger half a radar range away, ect. Unless you're literally across the map from your monks, there's no way you'll ever get spiked down or be at risk of death if you have Distortion on your bar.

We ran into a hex team today with something like 6 copies of Distortion. It simply wasn't possible to apply any significant pressure to them. Any target a warrior got on could just switch on Distortion and avoid any damage. Devoting that many defensive slots should be a large effect, but no defensive skill I can think of stacks in the same way as Distortion. It's not efficent to run 6 copies of anything else (res sig aside), but you do want to run Distortion on just about every soft target that can fit a /Me secondary.

I'm not at all sure whether it's overpowered, but it does seem like an extremely strong defensive skill at the moment. I'm curious if a nerf to Distortion would improve GvG, since players would have to worry a lot more about positioning rather than just wandering all over the map without fear.

Thoughts?

arredondo · Aug 21, 2006, 09:11 AM // 09:11

It's already been nerfed. Let's leave it alone.

Patrograd · Aug 21, 2006, 09:17 AM // 09:17

I think that the force into mesmer secondary might be restrictive, especially given the relatively high spec into illusion. For example, you couldnt have Ele's chaining Aegis, or spamming heal party. So its a trade off, a choice, and choices are good imo.

Its a nice skill, obviously very useful, but I dont think its that overpowered.

JR · Aug 21, 2006, 09:42 AM // 09:42

I will happily agree that Distortion is very powerfull. Whether I would say that it is necessarily overpowered is a different story; I don't really think that it is. It eats up a skill slot on a character that would otherwise be devoted to shut-down or offense, purely for self defense. That's quite a considerable trade, when just pre-kiting and positional awareness goes a long way towards self defense anyway. It basicly helps lazy players, or characters (such as a Me/Mo hard resser) who you know will be priority targets for the other team.

I'd say it was just on the 'ok' side of the balance line.

Greedy Gus · Aug 21, 2006, 09:46 AM // 09:46

Distortion is just so much better than other defensive stance options, even the ones tied to a class primary (expertise). The reason is the short recharge. You only activate it when you want it, it doesn't last longer than you need it, and it's always available. Something like whirling lasts way longer than you'd realistically need, and the recharge kills it.

This is the reason the previous nerfs haven't knocked this skill off it's spot on the list of top skills. The energy loss is only a minor inconvenience that you control, and never has balanced the skill to the level of the stances that have long recharges.

JR · Aug 21, 2006, 09:49 AM // 09:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Distortion is just so much better than other defensive stance options, even the ones tied to a class primary (expertise). The reason is the short recharge. You only activate it when you want it, it doesn't last longer than you need it, and it's always available. Something like whirling lasts way longer than you'd realistically need, and the recharge kills it.

This is the reason the previous nerfs haven't knocked this skill off it's spot on the list of top skills. The energy loss is only a minor inconvenience that you control, and never has balanced the skill to the level of the stances that have long recharges.

Do you think that is the fault of other defensive stances being trash, or Distortion being too powerfull?

Wasteland Squidget · Aug 21, 2006, 09:50 AM // 09:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Distortion is just so much better than other defensive stance options, even the ones tied to a class primary (expertise). The reason is the short recharge. You only activate it when you want it, it doesn't last longer than you need it, and it's always available. Something like whirling lasts way longer than you'd realistically need, and the recharge kills it.

This is the reason the previous nerfs haven't knocked this skill off it's spot on the list of top skills. The energy loss is only a minor inconvenience that you control, and never has balanced the skill to the level of the stances that have long recharges.

Agreed. Even if the energy loss were further increased, I don't think it would affect the skill's use that much. Not unless it's increased to completely ridiculous levels.

Of course, most of the stances with long recharges are also quite crappy for PvP. It's really a question of whether Distortion is overpowered, all the other self-defense options are underpowered, or both.

torquemada · Aug 21, 2006, 09:50 AM // 09:50

It seems that it became popular due to melee-oriented pressure. Forcing Distortion could shift meta away from melee heavy builds. I don't think it cries for nerf.

around · Aug 21, 2006, 09:52 AM // 09:52

The only reason Distortion is ran is because all the other evasive stances are complete and utter bullcrap. The only nerf that would actually nerf Distortion is if they increased the recharge.

Yanman.be · Aug 21, 2006, 09:54 AM // 09:54

Increase energy cost to 10 energy, duration to 10 seconds, this way, wild blow has more use.

Wasteland Squidget · Aug 21, 2006, 09:55 AM // 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by torquemada

It seems that it became popular due to melee-oriented pressure. Forcing Distortion could shift meta away from melee heavy builds. I don't think it cries for nerf.

Other than pure caster spike, is there an alternative to builds that get kills through melee?

Quote:

Originally Posted by spawnofebil

The only nerf that would actually nerf Distortion is if they increased the recharge.

It's that or reduce the evade rate. Increasing the recharge to 10-15s would probably leave the skill playable, but it might become too ineffective then. It would still give you a 5s window to escape, but after that you're on your own.

makosi · Aug 21, 2006, 10:03 AM // 10:03

Its the only defensive stance a mesmer has which isn't totally conditional (unlike mantra of flame, lightning, etc.) There are lots of warrior and ranger attacks that completely ignore these evasive stances.

Iressistible Blow, Seeking Arrows, Seeking Blade, Wild Blow. When you think of it like that, with the energy draining effects of distortion, its not that brilliant. Its one of the better mesmer skills but by no means overpowered.

Ulivious The Reaper · Aug 21, 2006, 10:29 AM // 10:29

i tottally agree with the OP but its easily countered with an assassin with wild strike, or a warrior with wild blow... i mean it doesn't screw up your skill bar that bad.. quit making your warriors play cookie cutters and let us do our things, we'll generally do what you want us to.

Wasteland Squidget · Aug 21, 2006, 10:33 AM // 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Iressistible Blow, Seeking Arrows, Seeking Blade, Wild Blow.

I wouldn't say that any of these skills is particularly strong against Distortion. You usually don't get more than 5-10 seconds to kill an overextended target before the opposing monks can reach him (assuming your team has a lot of snares.) If you have IB you may as well use it to get some guaranteed damage on a Distortion target, but your attack damage will still be coming slowly enough for him to get a heal in plenty of time. Wild Blow seems good at first, but with Distortion's recharge you won't get in more than 2 autoattacks before they turn it on again.

Likewise, if you're trying to pressure the enemy team, hitting a guy with Distortion gives their monks a break and undoes a lot of your work. You'll drain his energy, but you'll cut out a lot of your team's damage and give them a chance to recover.

In practice, Distortion is countered by Tab + Space. If a target on the enemy team has Distortion, you don't spike or pressure them much, since you'll never actually get the kill. Thus, having Distortion on your bar means you can do pretty much any job on the battlefield unhindered by a lot of what the enemy team can do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ulivious The Reaper

i tottally agree with the OP but its easily countered with an assassin with wild strike, or a warrior with wild blow... i mean it doesn't screw up your skill bar that bad.. quit making your warriors play cookie cutters and let us do our things, we'll generally do what you want us to.

Wild Strike doesn't do crap against Distortion, which is one of the reasons why it never sees play. It has to follow a Lead Attack, which you have only a 25% chance of actually hitting on a Distortion guy.

Wild Blow - I don't think it's necessarily a complete waste of a skillslot. It's nice for taking out Whirling on the Oath Shot trappers and spirit spammers that have been seen recently. It's also a halfway-decent Distortion counter, though not really good enough to carry the weight on its own. Wild Blow usually doesn't carry its weight compared to other skills, but there are times it's good to bring it along.

dgb · Aug 21, 2006, 10:39 AM // 10:39

I think the 10s duration 10e change with a relook at the energly loss numbers might be worth doing - it stops being as good as a throw-away stance because it lasts long enough that wanding+warriors if combined together could really hurt your energy where as currently if people try to burn you out of it, you can just get protted in the 5s it's up and then let it go.

Dragannia · Aug 21, 2006, 10:47 AM // 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

Iressistible Blow, Seeking Arrows, Seeking Blade, Wild Blow. When you think of it like that, with the energy draining effects of distortion, its not that brilliant. Its one of the better mesmer skills but by no means overpowered.

People who do say "Oh, Wild Blow" or "Oh, Wild Strike" or "Oh, IB" isn't getting the point of Distortion. If it's on, say, a Monk, the moment you get KDed is the moment you activate Distortion. If you even evade a single Eviserate or Crushing Blow, it's done its job. You would hardly have enough time to chain a Wild Blow into your combo, and even if you do it's worthless because your opening skill has already missed. Also, no one ever uses Wild Blow because, frankly, it's not all that effective.

JR · Aug 21, 2006, 10:55 AM // 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgb

I think the 10s duration 10e change with a relook at the energly loss numbers might be worth doing - it stops being as good as a throw-away stance because it lasts long enough that wanding+warriors if combined together could really hurt your energy where as currently if people try to burn you out of it, you can just get protted in the 5s it's up and then let it go.

I think at 10 energy you wouldn't really have to change up the energy loss per hit. The double duration effectively does nothing, as Distortion is used to save on spikes, and yet it costs the same amount. As such I think that is a big enough hit already. Then there is the fact that you are now commited to ten seconds of having Distortion up, and losing further energy if the opponent decides to wail on you. This effectively makes it unplayable on a Monk, as such I would argue that 10 energy cost with 5 duration is less of a nerf than 10 cost, 10 duration.

Poison Ivy · Aug 21, 2006, 11:07 AM // 11:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

I think at 10 energy you wouldn't really have to change up the energy loss per hit. The double duration effectively does nothing, as Distortion is used to save on spikes, and yet it costs the same amount. As such I think that is a big enough hit already. Then there is the fact that you are now commited to ten seconds of having Distortion up, and losing further energy if the opponent decides to wail on you. This effectively makes it unplayable on a Monk, as such I would argue that 10 energy cost with 5 duration is less of a nerf than 10 cost, 10 duration.

Actually with 10 energy and 10 duration, the a Warrior could whack away his energy in no time unless that person cancels Distortion.

Mesmers still need some kind of defence against Warriors other than kiting.

Yanman.be · Aug 21, 2006, 11:14 AM // 11:14

Omg you use frenzy to cancel distortion!! duh!!!!11111oneoneoeneleven9781983

psycho854 · Aug 21, 2006, 11:16 AM // 11:16

use it youreself and youll see its not overpowered! u loose big amount of mana and as a caster mana is youre health. so its a fair trade coz when u run out of mana you dont get DP but it makes you useless for ~10 secs.

so its not overpowered or whatever. just a chance for mesmers to avoid physical dmg! (pretty usefull with only AL60

)